Santo and the HOF numbers

[ryno4ever]

Bear with me on this one....

I was listening to banter on 670 the score...which I hate to listen to, but it was the only one talking baseball.... there was a debate as to whether Santo belongs into the HOF or not. One caller said his numbers were simply not good enough to qualify for the Hall of Fame. Now, I was not alive when Ron played, so I can't say I remember watching him, etc. I watched This Old Cub and after watching that, I could not believe this man was not in the HOF.

So, tonight, I got onto baseball-alamanac.com and did a little number comparisons. What I found certainly warrants Ronnie a plaque in the HOF, in my opinion. I looked up Hall of Fame third basemen...there are nine. I made a little chart with these nine and added Ron as the 10th. I compared every stat they had on that page...each of the nine and Santo's.... I will try to summarize what I discovered.

The nine 3B HOF: Frank Baker (played 13 years), George Brett (21 years), Jimmy Collins (14 years), George Kell (15years). Freddie Lindstrom (13 years), Eddie Matthews (17years), Brooks Robinson (23 years), Mike Schmidt (18 years), and Pie Traynor (17 years). Ron Santo played for 15 years.

Of the 10, I have Ron ranked 7th in number of triples. 6th of the 10 in Batting Average, Total Runs scored, RBIs, and Fielding %. He tied for 6th with OBP. He was 5th out of the 10 in number of career hits. He was 4th in slugging percentage, number of games at 3B, number of Errors. He was third in home runs, base on balls, fielding assists,and fielding double plays. He did not rank below
6th place in any of the cateogries.

The fielding stats, I took strictly on their numbers at third base, as that is the position they are listed in the HOF for, as many of them played other postions throughout their career.

Now, one stat I figured out on my own that they didn't list on the site was the one I found the most amazing. I didn't want to compare number of games played (total at all positions) between all of the players, as you had players such as Brooks Robinson who played for 23 years vs. Frank Baker who played for only 13...that is a 10 year difference and a lot of games. I figured out the games played per year average.......Santo was number one with 149.5 games per year played. Next behind him was Eddie Matthews with 140.6. The next one behind that was only at 133.6 (Robinson). All of the others were in the 120's down to 110.6 for Lindstrom. Why do I find this stat amazing??? Ronnie played with a disease that he hid for a good part of his career. Diabetes, back then, wasn't as well known or treated as it is now. Both my dad and brother have Diabetes, so I know the severety of the disease and what it can do to you...how hard it can be to control, even with a "normal" lifestyle. Now, that is why I find it amazing Ron put these kind of numbers up with Diabetes....and being on the road so much with not much of a "daily routine".

So, I wish to tell all of those callers who call into these sports radio shows...DO YOUR HOMEWORK BEFORE YOU OPEN YOUR MOUTHS ON THE AIR. Sorry about the rantin' and ravin'...but after my little project here, I have developed even more of a deep respect for this man, and if he doesn't get into the HOF it will be a shame for the game of baseball.

[ryno4ever]

You can contact the baseball HOF Veteran's Committee and put your plea in for Santo here:

The Veteran's HOF Baseball Committee (http://www.baseballhalloffame.org/hofers_and_honorees/veterans/contact.htm)

We need to flood them with lots of emails on how we need to get Santo in!

[diehardnorthsider]

Not to mention the Gold Gloves he won. Correct me guys if I'm wrong but didn't he win four or five?

[Webgem]

He deserved to be in years ago....it's a crying shame that guys that are in there now have produced less then he has and isn't in.

And I'm really tired of people saying he's not in because he didn't go to the playoffs or world series...:mad:

[scuba]

Nice post. It will go down as one that baseball got wrong for sure if he doesn't get in at some point. I can't believe it has taken this long.

[HOLYCOW!25]

Not to mention the Gold Gloves he won. Correct me guys if I'm wrong but didn't he win four or five?

It was 5 in a row

He was also on the Allstar team 9 of his 15 years.

Seriously, wtf?

[ryno4ever]

There are many, many, many things we can put down about Ron as for why he should be in the HOF. I just got so mad when this guy on the radio, who obviously was NOT a Cub fan, was trying to tell us there was no way he would ever get in just based on his numbers...then the fact he didn't play for a Championship team.

[scuba]

That "not playing for a championship team" thing is a crock. I suppose under this guy's logic, Peyton Manning won't end up in Canton someday either. :rolleyes:

[NeifiPerezMVP2007]

I think some of them remember that he had a really bad temper. He beat up a pizza vendor (I have this on 3 different sources now). Maybe thats the problem who knows. All I know is he should be in the HOF and should have been years ago. Its a crime!

[NeifiPerezMVP2007]

That "not playing for a championship team" thing is a crock. I suppose under this guy's logic, Peyton Manning won't end up in Canton someday either. :rolleyes:

EXACTLY RIGHT:)

[ryno4ever]

Tony Gwynn never won a Championship, so that blows another one of their excuses out of the water.

Gwynn hit only 135 homers -- matching McGwire's total in 1998 and 1999 -- and joked that he'd be the "Punch and Judy" spokesman for the next few months.

"For me, it's kind of validation because the type of player that I was doesn't get a whole lot of credit in today's game," he said. "I didn't win any championships. I didn't hit a whole lot of home runs. I didn't drive in a whole lot of people." (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AmAEPedx7rMMu05610qJ2po5nYcB?slug=ap-halloffame&prov=ap&type=lgns)

from Yahoo sports article....

[Sheffield_&_Waveland]

Couldn't agree with all of you anymore. And great work Ryno nice post.

[ryno4ever]

Thanks! I actually learned something new when "researching" it all...:)

[Drockvb]

Santo deserves to be inducted.
I am sick of the whole HOF thing. It's a popularity contest in all sports.
The HOF is a sham.

Ron Santo=Art Monk.

[roenick99]

I was arguing with a guy on here (ryno23hof) about how Santo should be in the HOF and he had the balls to say that the position he played means nothing and you either have HOF numbers or not. I brought Ryne Sandberg as a contradiction to his "theory". He pleaded ignorance to any naysayers of Sandberg and basically couldn't give a valid reason other than it is obvious he just doesn't like Ron Santo for whatever reason. Probably due to his "unique" style of broadcasting. I've included the link of our conversation on here. His argument, as well as, that of any Santo detractor is just weak. If you don't like the guy just come out and say it, but don't say he is not worthy when everyone knows he is...

http://www.fogpog.com/showthread.php?t=552&page=2

[roenick99]

Not to mention the Gold Gloves he won. Correct me guys if I'm wrong but didn't he win four or five?

5 gold gloves and 9 times to the AS game...

[Webgem]

Well if positions don't matter and numbers only why is Ozzie Smith in...he was a defensive genious but his offensive numbers ...well take a look...not HOF numbers period.

[roenick99]

Well if positions don't matter and numbers only why is Ozzie Smith in...he was a defensive genious but his offensive numbers ...well take a look...not HOF numbers period.

I totally agree. I'm still not sure about that one. At least, in the sense that he made it in on the first ballot and Ryno was second ballot. Whatever! It will never make sense to me. It hardly makes sense that the writers are the ones putting these guys in the HOF. Most of them don't know their *** from a hole in the ground and they are the deciding factor on who is Hall worthy and who is not? I think they need WRITTEN rules about who gets in instead of all these "unwritten" bench marks. SAY that 500 HR's is an automatic, SAY that 3000 hits is an automatic. Make a rule that until you are guilty beyond any doubt that you used performance enhancing drugs by way of...oh, I don't know... A FAILED DRUG TEST...then you ARE automaticlly eligible for the HOF. Palmeiro should be out because he failed a drug test. Unfortunately, Bonds has never failed a drug test (that we know of), so he is a HOFer in my eyes. I can't stand the guy, but I would still vote for him based on his numbers alone. If he is convicted of lying about the whole Balco thing, then he should get banned from the HOF because there is the proof that he used a steriod cream whether he "knew it" or not. I could go on all day, but it seems that there should and could be a massive overhaul of the way they do this thing. I don't think everyone should be in the HOF, but there are guys that are definitely worthy and are being shunned for one reason or another and they are NOT the right reasons!

I am really fired up this morning. Maybe I have had too much coffee! :D

[bringbacktuffy]

Ryno you should call into the show tomorrow or next time they are on air and blast these people ou tof the water. The excuses for Ronnie not being in are these :
numbers not good enough-- refuted through actual research
no championships- Tony Gwynn and im sure there are more
Temper- Ty Cobb anyone? If pro athletes dont have a killer instinct on the field they prob arent very good
the only reason anyone can give is that he played on a team with 3 other HOF members that didnt win a championship, and thats ridiculous. Joe Morgan can eat shiat.
The HOF is a farse, especially if Mac gets in before Santo or Dawson for that matter. Its just stupid.

[ryno4ever]

Ryno you should call into the show tomorrow or next time they are on air and blast these people ou tof the water. The excuses for Ronnie not being in are these :
numbers not good enough-- refuted through actual research
no championships- Tony Gwynn and im sure there are more
Temper- Ty Cobb anyone? If pro athletes dont have a killer instinct on the field they prob arent very good
the only reason anyone can give is that he played on a team with 3 other HOF members that didnt win a championship, and thats ridiculous. Joe Morgan can eat shiat.
The HOF is a farse, especially if Mac gets in before Santo or Dawson for that matter. Its just stupid.

I would...however, I really hate 670 the Score....I was only listening in because they were the only ones talking baseball, ESPN 1000 was talking Bulls and Bears. WGN wasn't even talking sports. So, I don't care to waste my time becuase the radio guys on 670 the score are a bunch of jerks who think their opinions are the only ones that are right and they treat their listeners as if they don't have a clue. (for those who don't live around the Chicago area, 670 the Score is the White Sox Flagship station, so they are very anti-Cub).

This wasn't the only time I had heard people say Ron's numbers weren't good enough for the HOF, so after I heard it again yesterday, it really peaked my curiousity.

[Ivy Killa]

I just read this on foxsports.com

2009 — Rickey Henderson, one of the all-time best leadoff hitters (.279 batting average; 2,295 runs; 3,055 hits; 297 HRs; 1,115 RBI; 1,406 stolen bases) should be elected on the first ballot. Mark Grace, Matt Williams and Dean Palmer had nice careers but aren't worthy of plaques in Cooperstown

Thats the biggest bunch of bull**** i've ever heard....Grace led the decade of the 90's in hits (i believe every other player that led their respective decade in hits got in). Had 4 gold gloves and c'mon it's Gracie.

[roenick99]

I just read this on foxsports.com

2009 — Rickey Henderson, one of the all-time best leadoff hitters (.279 batting average; 2,295 runs; 3,055 hits; 297 HRs; 1,115 RBI; 1,406 stolen bases) should be elected on the first ballot. Mark Grace, Matt Williams and Dean Palmer had nice careers but aren't worthy of plaques in Cooperstown

Thats the biggest bunch of bull**** i've ever heard....Grace led the decade of the 90's in hits (i believe every other player that led their respective decade in hits got in). Had 4 gold gloves and c'mon it's Gracie.

Sorry, I have to agree. Grace is not a HOFer. His numbers just don't stack up. I really like Mark Grace, but maybe he can make the Hall as a manager or an announcer some day. It would have definitely helped him to play another couple of seasons at a consistent level to get closer to 3000 hits or actually over the hump.

[Al Spanglers ghost]

Sorry, I have to agree. Grace is not a HOFer. His numbers just don't stack up. I really like Mark Grace, but maybe he can make the Hall as a manager or an announcer some day. It would have definitely helped him to play another couple of seasons at a consistent level to get closer to 3000 hits or actually over the hump.

I have to agree with roenick99,Grace was a very good player,his lack of HR and RBI production,for a guy who hit 3rd,4th or 5th in the lineup most of his career,hurts his over all numbers.Don't get me wrong I loved Gracie,he had a very nice career,but I don,t think he belongs in the HOF.

[Al Spanglers ghost]

Concerning Ron Santo and the HOF,there is no doubt that it is criminal that he is not already in. ryno4ever,I must say that was a truley a remarkable post.I have done much of the same number crunching as you,and people so often fail to take into account the 8 year difference when comparing Santo and Brooks Robinson's career numbers.As someone who grew up watching Ronnie play.[He was my favorite player growing up in the 60's,I played thirdbase,and wore #10 in little leauge because I loved Ronnie!],he was the premier thirdsacker of the national leauge in his era.
There are a couple things that ,I feel have worked against Ronnie getting into
the HOF,through the years.
In the days before cable TV,espn,superstations,etc,the only national exposure
a player would get was the game of the week,on saturday afternoons,which was a national broadcast,or in the all star game,or World Series.
Also,as anyone who listens to Ron on WGN radio knowns,he is a very emotional
person.He had a hard time hiding those emotions on the field as a player. Ronnie had a temper,which he often lost.When he was happy he showed it.
The clicking of his heels when the Cubs won a home game in 1969,I,as most Cub fans loved.But,a lot of the other teams,and fans,and writers didn,t think it was cute. [Pete Rose was a terrific ballplayer,but I hated him back in the day,for alot of the same things I loved about Ronnie!]
I just hope it happens [HOF]while Ron is still with us,because it means so much to him,and his fans.

[Ivy Killa]

Sorry, I have to agree. Grace is not a HOFer. His numbers just don't stack up. I really like Mark Grace, but maybe he can make the Hall as a manager or an announcer some day. It would have definitely helped him to play another couple of seasons at a consistent level to get closer to 3000 hits or actually over the hump.

I have to agree with roenick99,Grace was a very good player,his lack of HR and RBI production,for a guy who hit 3rd,4th or 5th in the lineup most of his career,hurts his over all numbers.Don't get me wrong I loved Gracie,he had a very nice career,but I don,t think he belongs in the HOF.

Good points...although i'm sure defensive minded Players have gotten into the hall with worse stats than Gracie's and although he only won 4 gold gloves he was or is one of the greatest defensive 1st basemen of all time....I'll tell you what though, no matter if he gets in or not, the Cubs should AT LEAST retire his number and give the guy a flag on one of the foul poles.....but i dont even know if that will ever happen...perhaps with Mcphail gone they'll be a little less picky with that kind of stuff.

[roenick99]

Good points...although i'm sure defensive minded Players have gotten into the hall with worse stats than Gracie's and although he only won 4 gold gloves he was or is one of the greatest defensive 1st basemen of all time....I'll tell you what though, no matter if he gets in or not, the Cubs should AT LEAST retire his number and give the guy a flag on one of the foul poles.....but i dont even know if that will ever happen...perhaps with Mcphail gone they'll be a little less picky with that kind of stuff.

Yes, he was pretty damn good defensively, but unfortunately for him 1st Base is one of those underappreciated defensive positions and requires you to have the pop in the bat to back it up. Who knows if he'll ever get the respect he deserves, but getting invited back to the organization by way of the Cubs Convention invitation is a good start. It can only go up from here.

On another note, I either heard or read somewhere about how Sammy was not invited to the Cubs Convention even though he said he would go. Could you imagine those two in the same room together? I couldn't imagine them at the same convention together... I could see Gracie smacking Sosa in the back with a folding chair as he walked in the door ala WWE. That might actually be kind of cool. Then Wood does a back flip off the interview table and lands a surgically repaired elbow on his back as he tries to get up. Maybe it would be even a little more poetic for someone to take him out with a boom box! Talk about irony... :D

[ryno4ever]

On another note, I either heard or read somewhere about how Sammy was not invited to the Cubs Convention even though he said he would go. Could you imagine those two in the same room together? I couldn't imagine them at the same convention together... I could see Gracie smacking Sosa in the back with a folding chair as he walked in the door ala WWE. That might actually be kind of cool. Then Wood does a back flip off the interview table and lands a surgically repaired elbow on his back as he tries to get up. Maybe it would be even a little more poetic for someone to take him out with a boom box! Talk about irony... :D

LOL...That is Hilarious! I don't know just how warmly Sosa would be recepted by most fans...or players... he must not realize that we don't forget things easily. He bailed on the team and the fans on FAN APPRECIATION DAY!

[HOLYCOW!25]

I sent a thing telling them how upset I was about Ron Santo not getting it, and I was surprised with the email I found today that they sent back. They actually read what I said.

Dear Friend:

We are in receipt of your letter. Thank you for taking the time to express your views to the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum.

We understand your disappointment in Ron Santo not earning election to the Baseball Hall of Fame. It is extremely difficult to earn election to the Hall of Fame, as only one percent -- 1 in 100 -- of those to have played in the major leagues earn a plaque in Cooperstown.

The Veterans Committee will again vote on players in 2007, with the announcement to be made on Feb. 27 at 2 p.m. at www.baseballhalloffame.org. Under the Veterans Committee process, he has the opportunity to earn election at any time in perpetuity, as long as he receives the necessary 75% of all ballots cast in any one election.

Mr. Santo first became eligible for induction into the National Baseball Hall of Fame in 1980. According to the Rules of Election, he was eligible for consideration by the BBWAA for 15 years. During that span of time, Mr. Santo garnered a considerable number of votes, though never more than the 75 percent required for induction.

While Mr. Santo is not currently a member of the Hall of Fame, he is represented in the Museum and Library as an important figure in baseball history. Among the interesting items in Cooperstown from his career are several photographs and a souvenir Ron Santo button from the 1960s.

[Ivy Killa]

Could you imagine those two in the same room together? I couldn't imagine them at the same convention together... I could see Gracie smacking Sosa in the back with a folding chair as he walked in the door ala WWE. That might actually be kind of cool. Then Wood does a back flip off the interview table and lands a surgically repaired elbow on his back as he tries to get up. Maybe it would be even a little more poetic for someone to take him out with a boom box! Talk about irony... :D


haha that's some funny ****....sounds like a PPV waiting to happen and i would definitely shell out the 30 or so bucks to see that.

[roenick99]

I sent a thing telling them how upset I was about Ron Santo not getting it, and I was surprised with the email I found today that they sent back. They actually read what I said.

Dear Friend:

We are in receipt of your letter. Thank you for taking the time to express your views to the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum.

We understand your disappointment in Ron Santo not earning election to the Baseball Hall of Fame. It is extremely difficult to earn election to the Hall of Fame, as only one percent -- 1 in 100 -- of those to have played in the major leagues earn a plaque in Cooperstown.

The Veterans Committee will again vote on players in 2007, with the announcement to be made on Feb. 27 at 2 p.m. at www.baseballhalloffame.org. Under the Veterans Committee process, he has the opportunity to earn election at any time in perpetuity, as long as he receives the necessary 75% of all ballots cast in any one election.

Mr. Santo first became eligible for induction into the National Baseball Hall of Fame in 1980. According to the Rules of Election, he was eligible for consideration by the BBWAA for 15 years. During that span of time, Mr. Santo garnered a considerable number of votes, though never more than the 75 percent required for induction.

While Mr. Santo is not currently a member of the Hall of Fame, he is represented in the Museum and Library as an important figure in baseball history. Among the interesting items in Cooperstown from his career are several photographs and a souvenir Ron Santo button from the 1960s.

Well S.H.I.T! He's got a couple of photos and "a souvenir Ron Santo button" in there. What the heck does he want the plaque for? That should be good enough for him and us! Nothing says respect and greatness like a ****ing **** sucking souvenir button. What a kick in the nuts. Sounds like a form letter with [Insert name here] and [Insert relevant useless crap here] sections. What a bunch of ***-bags...

Sorry, but I have no respect for this organization anymore and really don't want any of our great players associated with them. Do you think you can de-elect yourself from the Hall of Sham? What a joke...

[HOLYCOW!25]

It was a form letter. I just found out that ryno got the same exact one.

[ChiCubs1984]

Ya know the thing about Santo not being in the hall of fame because he didnt get into the playoffs or world series is bunk. Why did Fergie Jenkins, Billy Williams and Ernie Banks make it in then?? they were all part of the 1969 squad that blew the NL East that year. Santo played with guts, drive and love for his team which he still has today. I think he said it right when his number was retired and hanging a flag in left field of Wrigley Field was his hall of fame!!

[Webgem]

I sent a thing telling them how upset I was about Ron Santo not getting it, and I was surprised with the email I found today that they sent back. They actually read what I said.

Dear Friend:

We are in receipt of your letter. Thank you for taking the time to express your views to the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum.

We understand your disappointment in Ron Santo not earning election to the Baseball Hall of Fame. It is extremely difficult to earn election to the Hall of Fame, as only one percent -- 1 in 100 -- of those to have played in the major leagues earn a plaque in Cooperstown.

The Veterans Committee will again vote on players in 2007, with the announcement to be made on Feb. 27 at 2 p.m. at www.baseballhalloffame.org. Under the Veterans Committee process, he has the opportunity to earn election at any time in perpetuity, as long as he receives the necessary 75% of all ballots cast in any one election.

Mr. Santo first became eligible for induction into the National Baseball Hall of Fame in 1980. According to the Rules of Election, he was eligible for consideration by the BBWAA for 15 years. During that span of time, Mr. Santo garnered a considerable number of votes, though never more than the 75 percent required for induction.

While Mr. Santo is not currently a member of the Hall of Fame, he is represented in the Museum and Library as an important figure in baseball history. Among the interesting items in Cooperstown from his career are several photographs and a souvenir Ron Santo button from the 1960s.

I wrote them last night also and they replied with the same e-mail...I hope if enough of us do this it will make a difference.

[ryno4ever]

From the sounds of it...they just see Ron's name and automatically just reply with the same letter. I don't think it will even get passed on to the people that matter...the voters in the veteran's committee.

[scuba]

I can't believe the "souvenir Ron Santo button" thing. Is that somehow supposed to pay tribute to one of the greatest third basemen in baseball history??? What a joke.

[CubsDCHSia]

Sorry, HOLYCOW!25, the HOF probably didn't really read your e-mail. I sent them a message regarding Santo and recieved an identical e-mail. I was kind of pumped that they responded, but now it kind of sucks because I know they probably didn't read it. I bet they have a bunch of pre-written e-mails that they send out to people who ask them about certain players.

[champsx5]

So, I wish to tell all of those callers who call into these sports radio shows...DO YOUR HOMEWORK BEFORE YOU OPEN YOUR MOUTHS ON THE AIR. Sorry about the rantin' and ravin'...but after my little project here, I have developed even more of a deep respect for this man, and if he doesn't get into the HOF it will be a shame for the game of baseball.


Here's another "stat" to consider about Santo. When he retired in 1974, no thirdbaseman had more homers or RBI's than Santo in history except Eddie Matthews. Also, no thirdbaseman, except for Brooks Robinson, had more seasons leading the league in assists, putouts and total chances than Santo. He lead the NL for years in that category. So before 1960, there weren't very many decent thridbasemen. Santo was certainly the best third sacker in the NL during his era.

Had the Cubs won it in '69, Santo would be in, I think.
Great post. I'm as passionate as you are on the Santo/HOF debate. He should be in, and I hope Smith and Dawson get in too. I know Dawson and Rice are tweaners, but they each were one of the best in their respective leagues. Ask pitchers if they wanted to pitch to those guys. And Dawson was a great fielder too. His arm was likened to Clemente's arm. Isn't Andre like one of three or four guys to be in the 300/300 club? (300 homers, 300 steals)

[Al Spanglers ghost]

Here's another "stat" to consider about Santo. When he retired in 1974, no thirdbaseman had more homers or RBI's than Santo in history except Eddie Matthews. Also, no thirdbaseman, except for Brooks Robinson, had more seasons leading the league in assists, putouts and total chances than Santo. He lead the NL for years in that category. So before 1960, there weren't very many decent thridbasemen. Santo was certainly the best third sacker in the NL during his era.

Had the Cubs won it in '69, Santo would be in, I think.
Great post. I'm as passionate as you are on the Santo/HOF debate. He should be in, and I hope Smith and Dawson get in too. I know Dawson and Rice are tweaners, but they each were one of the best in their respective leagues. Ask pitchers if they wanted to pitch to those guys. And Dawson was a great fielder too. His arm was likened to Clemente's arm. Isn't Andre like one of three or four guys to be in the 300/300 club? (300 homers, 300 steals)


You're right about the Hawk,he is one of 5 players with 300HR/300SB in their
careers.
Up until last season there were only 3 players with 300/300.
Willie Mays,Andre Dawson,Barry Bonds,joined last year by Reggie Sanders and
Steve Finley.[somehow those last two seem very out of place to me!]
What kind of numbers Hawk would of put up on 2 healthy knees,god only knows.To bad the HOF,can't be voted more on guts,and playing the game at it's highest level at all times,and less about only numbers,and statistics.
If that were the case then Ron Santo and Andre Dawson would both get in on a first ballot.

[ARamfan]

You can contact the baseball HOF Veteran's Committee and put your plea in for Santo here:

The Veteran's HOF Baseball Committee (http://www.baseballhalloffame.org/hofers_and_honorees/veterans/contact.htm)

We need to flood them with lots of emails on how we need to get Santo in!

Thanks for the link Ryno, I submitted my plea to the HOF Baseball Committee regarding this matter. Between all of us here at fogpog, I'd like to get this done while he's still around.:(

[ryno4ever]

Good luck, Eddie! You'll probably end up getting the same letter the rest of us have gotten...starting with "Dear Friend..." If you get something different, please let us know!

[ARamfan]

It was a form letter. I just found out that ryno got the same exact one.

I just got the same one too:( But at least I got to put my two cents in regarding the disgraceful fact that Ron Santo has not yet been inducted into the HOF!:mad:

[ryno4ever]

Yeah, but do they acutally read the letter, or do they see the words "Ron Santo" and just hit the file for the form letter?

[scuba]

I'm guessing they don't actually get read. I mean, what would really be the point for them to read them? They know it's a sham he isn't in and just don't want to do anything about it. :mad:

[ryno4ever]

And to turn it into "We hope you visit Cooperstown soon"...and spend your hard earned money, but we don't have time or want to read what you think. UGH

[ryno4ever]

This is an old thread... but the numbers don't change. With the whole Santo/HOF thing coming up on just a couple of days... it's interesting to look back on. (Note, this thread was made in January of 2007)

[taz57]

Heather.

It's too bad that you were never able to see Santo in action. I was fortunate to see a Santo homerun in my very first game at Wrigley in August of 69. Williams and Banks also homered in a 12-2 rout of the Giants.

As what your idol Ryne Sandberg said in his Hall of Fame speech, he played the game the way it's suppose to be played. By the end of the game, Santo's uniform was filthy. And his homeruns didn't just float out to the bleachers. He had that uppercut swing and the ball would go so high, you wondered if it would ever come down.

I just have a feeling that he will get in this time.

[Drockvb]

It will take an overwhelming show of support for Santo, for him to get in.

I have been saying for a long time now that Santo is baseball's Art Monk. During his era he was awesome, and that gets forgotten today. Art led in almost every wide receiver stat as a player when his days wound down. Everyone forgot how good he was because the game changed and teams started gunning the ball down field more and more every year.

Santo's numbers are being overshadowed because the game has changed. 3rd base has become a power position. Teams now want 30 homers a year from their 3rd basemen. The game has changed and the accomplishments that Santo achieved don't look as good today as they did 30 years ago. This is what happened to Monk as well. Monk's numbers don't look as good as they did when he retired. But if you saw either play, you would agree that they both deserve to be a Hall of Famer.

How did Monk get in? Overwhelming support by fans!!! We basically never gave up and kept plugging the issue down the media's throat. IT WORKED! The same needs to happen for Santo. People need the drive to keep this an issue and bring it to the forefront whenever applicable.

[ryno4ever]

Numerous of us here on fogpog sent emails after I wrote this post originally... and we all received the exact same email back...

I just hope that the voters aren't keeping him out because of the public pressure to get him in there... the sound like a bunch of stubborn old men.

[LeeEila's/rant]

Great post Ryno !!

After the steroid era there is the thought that " enhanced " players should not be considered , or at least it should take away from their numbers , if the same people want to be intellectually honest , they would have to say anyone playing with such a debilitating disease should be given extra credit . If you take the fact that he had to fight diabetes and was still able to achieve what he did it is silly that it took this long.

It was just that he was so intense when he played that he pissed off many players and it was personal.